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                                                             on Gopher (inofficial)
   URI Visit Hacker News on the Web
       
       
       COMMENT PAGE FOR:
   URI   PeerTube 4 RC
       
       
        praveen9920 wrote 2 days ago:
        I get excited whenever I see a new federated alternative of existing
        big players, like PeerTube ( vs Youtube ) or Mastadon ( vs Twitter ) or
        Diaspora ( vs facebook ) but unfortunately I never get around to using
        them considering longevity of a single/multiple nodes in the system. I
        know it does not make sense but fear or losing/migrating
        preferences/data has kept me from using most of these services
       
          kzrdude wrote 2 days ago:
          What data is there to lose? I think it's best to just jump in and
          try, if you want to.
       
        timbit42 wrote 2 days ago:
        How is this similar or different from LBRY / Odysee?
       
          DoItToMe81 wrote 1 day ago:
          There's no blockchain involved or cryptocurrency, you do not need to
          pay to make a transaction, votes are one-user-one-vote rather than
          weighted by ownership of the currency, it is easily capable of
          federating with non-Peertube services due to Activitypub.
          
          LBRY uses IPFS to achieve P2P data transfer, while Peertube uses
          webtorrent or HLS, with a preference towards the latter. Peertube
          also seems easier to set up, at least to me.
       
            orblivion wrote 1 day ago:
            The IPFS on LBRY also means that the videos themselves don't have a
            "home" on one particular server. It's more like torrenting files.
            
            Correct me if I'm wrong, but I assume that if you take down a
            server holding a peertube video, it's not as though clients who
            have seen the video (or even federated servers?) would continue
            serving that video. The P2P aspect is merely a bandwidth saving
            scheme when clients are playing the video?
       
              DoItToMe81 wrote 1 day ago:
              Another server has to set up a video redundancy for the clip for
              that to happen. Otherwise, yeah, it just goes poof. Avoiding this
              is one of the major benefits of IPFS.
       
                orblivion wrote 1 day ago:
                It's cool that redundancy is a built-in feature at least.
       
          orblivion wrote 2 days ago:
          I don't think there's a blockchain or currency involved with
          Peertube. It's more like Mastodon for videos. In fact, you can follow
          Peertube accounts and comment on Peertube videos using your Mastodon
          account.
       
        olah_1 wrote 2 days ago:
        The elephant in the room is that videos take a long time to create. And
        thus hosting of the videos won’t easily be trusted to random server
        admins.
        
        I barely trust pleroma/mastodon admins with my garbage little text
        posts. I wouldn’t want to put my hard work on a server with no
        guarantee of how long they’ll be there or if one of them will be
        deleted and maybe I won’t even realize it.
        
        Yes, youtube sometimes deletes channels or videos. That isn’t perfect
        either. But somehow Peertube feels even worse because the entire
        fediverse is run by a bunch of “some guys” that are accountable to
        no one.
       
          robobro wrote 2 days ago:
          if you can trust yourself, host your own. that's the point
       
            olah_1 wrote 2 days ago:
            That limits the userbase to only people that are savvy enough to be
            a server admin, though. I've actually been discouraged from running
            my own server by people in the Matrix Chat world. Apparently there
            are risks if you're not knowledgable enough.
       
          shkkmo wrote 2 days ago:
          It seems to me that a federated system like PeerTube would give you
          more control over which admins you are beholden since you can choose
          where to publish. You could even setup your own host if you don't
          trust any of them
          
          Also, can't you post your videos to other platforms and/or keep your
          own backups? If the host deletes your video, can't you just republish
          it on a different one?
       
        pezzana wrote 2 days ago:
        An alternative to centralized video sharing is definitely needed and
        PeerTube looks interesting.
        
        Discoverability is one of the things that makes YouTube so compelling.
        Unfortunately, it doesn't look like PeerTube offers much on this front
        at the moment.
        
        There's a search app: [1] But there's nothing like the recommendations
        or related video feature of YouTube. How hard would that be to add
        given PeerTube's architecture?
        
        edit: I just discovered that that GitHub page does a much better job
        than the landing page of explaining PeerTube. In particular, it breaks
        down features from the perspective of users, creators, and admins. It
        even leads with an introductory video (but not embedded for some
        reason).
        
   URI  [1]: https://sepiasearch.org/
   URI  [2]: https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube
       
          encryptluks2 wrote 2 days ago:
          PeerTube is still centralized to whatever federated instance you are
          using. Still waiting on a true decentralized solution.
       
            mariusor wrote 2 days ago:
            I might be inferring the wrong thing from what you're saying, but I
            believe you're wrong.
            
            The same video that is uploaded on multiple instances can share
            peers, so when you're watching it, you get it in a decentralized
            fashion.
       
              MayeulC wrote 2 days ago:
              Also videos are regular webtorrents, they can be downloaded (or
              watched) without any support from the instance, as long as one
              peer is online. Less sure about video description and comments
              (though comments received by your instance should be displayed).
       
            skinnyasianboi wrote 2 days ago:
            Check out the LBRY protocol and the LBRY desktop app or it's
            centralized frontend  Odysee
       
              olah_1 wrote 2 days ago:
              LBRY desktop is also centralized btw. AFAIK there are no front
              ends built by totally different teams from LBRY, although there
              could be.
       
          littlestymaar wrote 2 days ago:
          While I agree that recommendation are what made YouTube so popular,
          and also boosts engagement a lot, they are also the most
          controversial feature of YouTube because they tend to converge toward
          the most polarizing videos, conspiracy theories, etc. They've also
          been gamed in a few creepy ways[1]:
          
   URI    [1]: https://medium.com/@jamesbridle/something-is-wrong-on-the-in...
       
            zo1 wrote 2 days ago:
            YouTube literally keeps showing me the same Playlist of videos
            every day, and absolutely refuses to let me get anything fresh
            until I behave like a good cow user and watch the videos they want
            me to so they can milk my eyeballs with ad views.
       
              fwip wrote 2 days ago:
              On the web client, it's easy to mark these videos as "Not
              Interested." I haven't noticed them showing up again after that.
       
                zo1 wrote 2 days ago:
                The problem is that it's the type of content that I generally
                want to watch. So if I mark it as not interested I'm assuming
                it'll generalize and not give me the same kind of content.
                Stuck between a rock and a hard place.
                
                The reason I would prefer not to mark as "not interested" is
                that there is so much content that is being produced by
                channels that I subscribe to that I never get recommended to
                me.
       
        markvdb wrote 2 days ago:
        The PeerTube developer community is super friendly and helpful to new
        developers. I contributed some minor improvements around a year ago,
        minimally touching several sides of the projects:
        
        - documentation for the SAML plugin
        
        - translation to my native language
        
        - some improvements to enable better encoding performance through
        hardware encoding
        
        My experience with the maintainers was nothing but positive, in all
        three areas. Such a warm welcome is rare in development land, so I
        commend the PeerTube maintainers not only for their excellent software,
        but also for their welcoming attitude.
       
          paulcarroty wrote 2 days ago:
          That's nice to hear, sometimes my bugreports to open source projects
          was threatened like enemy attacks.
       
        crispyporkbites wrote 2 days ago:
        It took me a long time to find it, but this is "the" search engine for
        PeerTube: [1] This could be a reasonable entry point for a
        non-technical user who just wants to watch videos. If you layer in
        recommendations system, trending etc. and have a default "Instance" for
        users to join, Peertube could start to compete with the user experience
        of YouTube
        
   URI  [1]: https://sepiasearch.org/
       
          betwixthewires wrote 2 days ago:
          These recommendations you're laying out to help compete with YouTube
          are antithetical to the whole purpose of peertube.
          
          First, a default instance is definitely a bad idea if you're trying
          to build a decentralized network of tube site servers, and it
          increases cost on a central entity in the network (probably framasoft
          who would be hosting the "default" server). The whole idea is for
          there not to be a central server.
          
          Recommendations and trending are architecturally untenable as well as
          antithetical. When you're collecting whatever criteria makes a video
          "good" from disparate servers across the web you introduce a ton of
          bandwidth and other issues. And why would anyone want some algorithm
          deciding for them what they feel like watching? Beyond that,
          something like this is hard to get right, you're more likely to get
          it wrong and wind up with pissed off users.
       
        webscout wrote 2 days ago:
        If this is the current pinnacle of the decentralised Web, I don't
        expect to see a YT competitor in my lifetime.
       
          olah_1 wrote 2 days ago:
          I don’t think it’s the pinnacle, no. I think the fediverse has
          been a stopgap. Not trying to minimize the hard work of these
          developers, but the user experience just doesn’t make sense.
       
          tomcooks wrote 2 days ago:
          Please show your solution so we can follow it verbatim
       
        2Gkashmiri wrote 2 days ago:
        this is super nice. i have submitted patches to the project out of
        curiosity and they were accepted. A nice community on github. I would
        suggest people here to try using the website , tilvids.com is a perfect
        example. i was doing its beta testing of the livestreaming and i found
        30 seconds delay between screen recording and viewing on a client. That
        was some random russian server so the latency was bad anyways because
        of location but still.
        
        Tldr; tilvids.com
       
        zibzab wrote 2 days ago:
        PSA:
        
        If your are de-googled and use NewPipe to watch YouTube, it already
        supports PeerTube (and more).
        
   URI  [1]: https://f-droid.org/en/packages/org.schabi.newpipe/
       
          sschueller wrote 2 days ago:
          I made an android client specifically for peertube also open source:
          [1] Any help with development is very welcome as I have little time
          to invest at the moment.
          
   URI    [1]: https://github.com/sschueller/peertube-android
       
          jerheinze wrote 2 days ago:
          NewPipe is such a nice piece of FOSS. Too bad that they decided
          against integrating SponsorBlock.
       
            lol768 wrote 2 days ago:
            Yeah, just read through the GitHub issues thread and it's  rather
            flimsy justification for not implementing it that seems to boil
            down to "because I don't want to". A real shame, since I'd always
            admired the project.
       
              betwixthewires wrote 2 days ago:
              "Because I don't want to" is a perfectly valid reason to not
              implement something in free software.
       
            glidergun wrote 2 days ago:
            This fork integrates sponsorblock, been using it for a while and
            even though the maintainer calls the integration "rather basic" it
            works quite well.
            
   URI      [1]: https://github.com/polymorphicshade/NewPipe
       
            Bayart wrote 2 days ago:
            I'm really glad YT Vanced did integrate it.
       
              Lammy wrote 1 day ago:
              It would be weird if it didn’t considering its name is
              “Youtube Advanced without the ‘Ad’” :)
       
              k__ wrote 2 days ago:
              What's the difference between Vanced and NewPipe?
       
                rakoo wrote 2 days ago:
                Newpipe is Libre Software, Vanced is not
       
                Bayart wrote 2 days ago:
                Vanced is a mod of the stock YT app, NewPipe is a completely
                new codebase that doesn't use YT's API.
       
                  k__ wrote 2 days ago:
                  How does it get the YT data if it doesn't use its API?
       
                    bubblethink wrote 1 day ago:
                    The way your browser can watch YT.
       
        zibzab wrote 2 days ago:
        Have you noticed YouTube heavily throttling unofficial clients lately?
        
        Maybe we really need a video delivery service that doesn't break every
        other day to please beancounters at Google.
       
          meibo wrote 2 days ago:
          Yes, if you don't provide a correct token that is calculated in
          heavily obfuscated javascript, the CDN will throttle you to
          kilobyte/s levels, basically making it impossible to watch anything
          real-time.
          
          The common way to deal with this seems to be to "emulate" the
          function calls on the input data, which seem to be randomized.
       
          ollybee wrote 2 days ago:
          Yes, I have a browser plugin to open youtube links in mpv, but it's
          been unusable recently with constant buffering. I dont even fetch
          them at best quality.
       
            markvdb wrote 2 days ago:
            pip install yt-dlp
            
            In ~/.config/mpv/mpv.conf, add the following line, preferably near
            the top:
            
            script-opts-add=ytdl_hook-ytdl_path=yt-dlp
            
            That should hopefully solve your issue.
       
              mssdvd wrote 2 days ago:
              You don't need to update the config if you have the latest
              version of mpv (0.34) released one month ago.
       
            circularfoyers wrote 2 days ago:
            Are you using yt-dlp with mpv?
       
            Saint_Genet wrote 2 days ago:
            Even the official client has been buffering heavily on iOS for the
            last two days. No idea what's going on, but I'm getting RealPlayer
            flashbacks.
       
              Isthatablackgsd wrote 2 days ago:
              Oh goodie, I am not the only one. I ran into this issue last
              night and YouTube app in my iPad is buffering heavily and stuck
              in 480p. My usual solution for this is to restart the iPad. Yup,
              have to restart the iPad because swipe-to-close didn't help.
       
          contravariant wrote 2 days ago:
          If you mean youtube-dl then you might be better of migrating to
          yt-dlp. It doesn't look like youtube-dl is going to resolve those
          throttling issues any time soon.
       
            zibzab wrote 2 days ago:
            Nope, Google is actively targeting different tools, yt-dlp
            included.
            
            It's a game of whack-a-mole right now.
       
        yuri91 wrote 2 days ago:
        I like the idea of PeerTube, but I have a question:
        
        How well does the p2p offloading of viral videos work in practice?
        
        How is the average user experience? Do you get a lot of buffering
        pauses, or is it seamless as if it was Youtube? Assuming a medium-sized
        server hosting the content.
       
          DoItToMe81 wrote 2 days ago:
          The most concurrent views I've seen on my server was about forty one,
          including myself. It was seamless, however the video was only around
          280 megabytes and there was only one quality setting for it. I don't
          imagine it being the case for HD videos where users are viewing in
          disparate qualities.
       
          booteille wrote 2 days ago:
          Actually, the experience is really fluid for most people. There can
          be some edgecases where we have users reporting huge bufferings but
          that's rare and hard to diagnostic since often bound to the client.
          
          Before the V3, we tried the live with more than 150people watching at
          the same time with some friends. 1/5 of the bandwidth was served by
          the server, P2P handled the rest.
          
          Since then, things continued to improve and the goal of Framasoft
          (from which I am external, so ask directly to Framasoft if you have
          specific question) is to provide the most stable experience with
          PeerTube.
          
          You can find out our feedback (in french, though), on Framasoft
          forums:
          
   URI    [1]: https://framacolibri.org/t/fonctionnalite-live-retour-dutili...
       
          devoutsalsa wrote 2 days ago:
          My experience to date has been the buffering I experience while
          watching a video kills the experience.
       
        quiffledwerg wrote 2 days ago:
        This project needs marketing people on the team.
        
        I’m interested in peertube it’s an exciting concept. When I when to
        that page I expected a simple, clean design inviting me to download it
        or use it or whatever. Instead there’s a rambling unfocused page
        without a call to action.
        
        YouTube is the Mike Tyson of video…. you’ve gotta be much better
        than this to get in the ring with YouTube.
       
          agumonkey wrote 2 days ago:
          I was tempted to agree but considering they managed to make such a
          nice and large piece of software without marketing.. I'd keep the
          marketing low and let the energy flow organically.
       
          streamofdigits wrote 2 days ago:
          consider though that if peertube just emulates the practices of
          existing players the result will likely be exactly the same
          
          the high thresholds and lack of mainstream polish of most open source
          projects is a true fact and has to do with the economic / business
          models (or non-models) so its not an easy challenge to solve
          
          somehow being able to engage creative people to contribute (whether
          it is UI design, visual art, engaging text etc) will be critical for
          FOSS to have bigger impact
       
          booteille wrote 2 days ago:
          The people behind PeerTube are the non-for-profit Framasoft.
          
          Actually, there is only one developer, not even working full time, on
          the project, and some lovely contributors.
          
          So Framasoft is actually not playing with same means than big players
          like YouTube or so.
          That's why they are not handling the problem the same way.
          
          The goal here is mainly to build a tool for people and small
          structures. There is no intent to be the new YouTube.
          
          The message is more humble: anyone should be able to host and share
          at low cost their own videos.
          That's the issue that PeerTube solves right now.
          
          If you think all of that sounds good, think about donating to
          Framasoft. They are living mostly from donations and that's what made
          PeerTube possible.
          
   URI    [1]: https://framasoft.org/en/#support
       
          presentation wrote 2 days ago:
          Agree, the way it’s presented will pretty much guarantee nobody but
          hardcore nerds will ever use it, it’s sad that noble efforts hobble
          themselves in this way.
          
          I mean isn’t it ironic that PeerTube doesn’t use a PeerTube video
          to introduce its new features? Guess their team thinks their own
          product isn’t a good way of consuming interesting information…
       
            betwixthewires wrote 2 days ago:
            So the site is about a server you can run that will be your very
            own tube site. Who other than nerds is going to install that? It
            requires administration, you're going to be very interested in
            running an instance to the point of commitment before you go there.
       
            qudat wrote 2 days ago:
            Great idea and totally agree.  Even someone who has been
            de-googling for awhile cannot step away from YT and PeerTube just
            isn't the same thing at all.
       
            roenxi wrote 2 days ago:
            It'd certainly be nice (although an oxymoron) if Framasoft could
            singlehandedly create a deep decentralised network of video content
            creators to challenge YouTube. But that isn't really necessary - if
            all they do is bring down the cost of someone else to compete then
            that is more than enough to be helpful.
            
            And while I do agree that a savvy marketer would have had a video
            in the article ... a video is actually a bad medium for
            communicating a new release. Videos are better for stuff with a bit
            of visual spectacle.
       
              loceng wrote 2 days ago:
              Does the license allow commercial use without releasing any
              modifications? Else it doesn't make sense for a potential
              competitor to provide improvements to create additional
              competitors for themselves.
       
                rakoo wrote 2 days ago:
                I think you are still under the impression that success is
                still based on codebase and you just need the perfect source
                code to build the most successful service. That's wrong.
                Success is built on relentless labor, continuous marketing and
                luck. That's why Gitlab can build a successful company while
                dailymotion can fail to build what is functionally not new.
       
                  loceng wrote 1 day ago:
                  I think you're lacking enough data points to determine what
                  impression I'm under, making assumptions as to my
                  perspective, where my question is coming from.
                  
                  There is a competitive advantage to not giving your future
                  competition a heads up by providing them your keys to the
                  foundation of your Kingdom. Sure, they'll copy what you do
                  eventually if what you're doing is working, but why make that
                  easier for them?
                  
                  If someone is seriously going to take on the current systems
                  and sees value in part or all of PeerTube then it's not a
                  substantial part of the cost, because as you say, it's not
                  the codebase that's important - though it becomes a
                  conversation piece if it means any additions to the codebase
                  reduces an even temporary competitive advantage from
                  potential future competitors.
       
                M2Ys4U wrote 2 days ago:
                PeerTube itself is licenced under the AGPL.
                
                But that wouldn't stop a non-AGPL licenced solution from
                interoperating as the network is based on an open standard
                (ActivityPub).
       
          BjornW wrote 2 days ago:
          The url points to a blogpost at Framasoft with information on the
          release canidate. If you visit the homepage of Peertube ( [1] )
          you'll likely find the information you are looking for.
          
   URI    [1]: https://joinpeertube.org
       
            Saint_Genet wrote 2 days ago:
            If you go to that site you don't get tons of videos, you get a
            technical explanation of what it is and a link to a page with 10
            channels. Unless you're the kind of person who is on HN, you're
            just gonna go to youtube instead.
       
            aosaigh wrote 2 days ago:
            I think this is a good example of what separates HN users from
            normal users. The fact that the blog is on a completely different
            domain and using a different name is confusing. What's more, when
            you visit the Peertube domain it's not clear what you should do. Do
            I need to download something? What's an instance? How come the top
            video on the page brings me to a separate page?
            
            I know these are things that most HN users are happy to dig into
            and figure out, but currently there's no way Peertube is "an
            alternative to video platforms" for even saavy web users, let alone
            regular users. Maybe that's OK though?
       
              Zababa wrote 2 days ago:
              The way peertube is an alternative to youtube is not by end users
              understanding what it is, but by technical users hosting
              themselves the videos. For example, OCaml has a peertube instance
              to watch OCaml related content: [1] . This is an alternative to
              watching the content on youtube.
              
   URI        [1]: https://watch.ocaml.org/
       
              laurentb wrote 2 days ago:
              not really,
              Framasoft is a French company that develops a collection of open
              source alternatives to popular software.
              
              It's the same as if Microsoft was posting a blog on its own
              msdn.com domain for something related to visual studio or
              SharePoint
       
                cameronh90 wrote 2 days ago:
                > msdn.com
                
                Doesn't exist any more. It's now all under microsoft.com (e.g.
                devblogs.microsoft.com).
       
                igorkraw wrote 2 days ago:
                Small correction, it's a non-profit association that can be
                placed in the same cluster as Mozilla, the EFF, the CCC or the
                Linux Foundation (i.e., the good guys if you care about FOSS
                and an open software and internet world)
       
                dewey wrote 2 days ago:
                > It's the same as if Microsoft was posting a blog on its own
                msdn.com domain for something related to visual studio or
                SharePoint
                
                Which underlines the point that the parent is making. Normal
                users are not the ones reading things related to SharePoint.
                Apple does their announcements on the apple.com domain and not
                on applnews.com.
                
                > I think this is a good example of what separates HN users
                from normal users.
       
                  ekianjo wrote 2 days ago:
                  > Normal users are not the ones reading things related to
                  SharePoint.
                  
                  Normal users would never ever find this blog post in the
                  first place. You are trying to fix a problem that does not
                  exist.
       
                    dtonon wrote 2 days ago:
                    The "Read the blog post" link is placed in the first
                    highlighted box of the project's homepage :)
       
                  detaro wrote 2 days ago:
                  Normal users are also not the ones primarily expected to read
                  release notes for release candidates for the Peertube server
                  software. Sharepoint is arguably a good comparison: run by
                  administrators for users - it's just that peertube is more
                  interesting to nerds that are both in one (although I'm sure
                  there's some folks with sharepoint at home...).
       
              mshanu wrote 2 days ago:
              I think this is the challenge with all decentralised systems, its
              not as easy as you click some buttons and you get served like in
              web 2. Hope more focus will come on experience part of this, for
              such approaches to become popular
       
       
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